Introduction:
Wang Tong
Position: Director, Beijing Samsung Telecommunication Research
Center
Nationality: China
Date of Birth: June 24, 1962
Education Degree: 1984, Bachelor of Science in Telecommunications
Engineering from Beijing University of Posts and Telecommunications
Experience:
1984-1991 Served in Beijing Design Institute of the MII
1991-1994 Deputy Director of Switching Division in Beijing
Design Institute of the MII
1994-1997 Director of Switching Division in Beijing Design
Institute of the MII
1997-2000 Vice President of Beijing Design Institute of
the MII
2000 till now Beijing Samsung Telecommunication Research
Center
Samsung¡¯s Road to TD-SCDMA:
Began from ¡°Playing it Hard¡±
Wang Jing: Thank you Mr. Wang for accepting this dialogue
in the TD-SCDMA executive interview series carried out by
TD-SCDMA Forum and Sina.com, and this is the 12th interview.
These interviews are very popular on the Tech Channel of
Sina.com, and the page view is often very high. Recently,
especially after the trial commercial use, people began
paying attention on this issue, and the contribution that
foreign enterprises have made in the field of TD-SCDMA is
especially highlighted. Recently, the TD-SCDMA Forum visited
with China Mobile. They are interested in this issue as
well, especially in terms of terminals. For example, how
to engage big multinational companies in the business to
push TD-SCDMA terminals with more effort, and to involve
other leading vendors in the business.
As we know, Samsung is a company entered TD-SCDMA business
from early on. Can you please introduce the development
path of TD-SCDMA in Samsung?
Wang Tong: Beijing Samsung Telecommunication Research Center
was founded in 2000, but as a matter of fact, the headquarters
of Samsung has been engaging in the research of TDD before
our establishment. We have a division of work with the headquarters
that their key work is on FDD and ours is on TDD. When TD-SCDMA
Forum established, we were very eager and participated in
the first time.
Wang Jing: It was in 2000.
Wang Tong: I had just entered Samsung at that time. The
executives at Datang such as Mr. ZHOU Huan, Mr. YANG Yigang
and Mr. YANG Hua all wished Samsung mobile phone could join
the industry chain of TD-SCDMA. In their opinion, there
are plenty of companies researching into system, and there
will not be problem if they take Datang as the center. The
problem was there was no investment from those big names
in the market of terminals. Later we pushed the process
actively, and finally our headquarters decided to invest
in TD-SCDMA chips, when Philips, Datang Mobile and Samsung
set up T3G jointly. The shareholders are from the three
fields of terminal, chip, and protocol stack. In the meantime
of investing in T3G, TD-SCDMA mobile phone team was set
up in the Samsung Research Center.
Wang Jing: It is said your research into TD-SCDMA began
in 2001, and TD-SCDMA terminal team was established in 2002.
Wang Tong: Yes, we decided to ¡°play it hard¡± from the beginning.
At that time, Commit was established before T3G, we had
to take it seriously and do it seriously. So since then,
the TD-SCDMA team at Samsung was working at T3G and all
the people were there. The work on chips had only begun
at that time, so we brainstormed on the topics such as reference
design and protocol stacks. It was a great cooperation.
And later no matter chips or terminals, we made a lot of
¡°number one¡±¡®s. This is the basis for our success in TD-SCDMA.
Later T3G gave us a lot of testing work to us, including
some chip versions in their infancy. Samsung Research Center
helped T3G a lot in later testing works. The close cooperation
laid a foundation of the consistent leading position in
the development of mobile phones for Samsung.
Wang Jing: I have two feelings after your talk. 1. As the
representative of Samsung, I believed you had made a lot
of effort to persuade the headquarters, especially in 2000,
2001 and 2002. It was the earliest stage of TD-SCDMA, and
the future of TD-SCDMA in China remained unpredictable.
You must have the deep understanding of the way China¡¯s
market operates and the strong influence from government.
Or you wouldn¡¯t be able to convince the headquarters, and
the decision-makers at Samsung were really wise. 2. You
said to ¡°do it seriously¡±; I don¡¯t think that was easy to
say at that time. I took charge of the Forum on 20005, which
is several years later from your ¡°do it seriously¡±. And
many companies I visited were just talking about it instead
of really doing anything. While you began investing in T3G
from the very beginning. We can see the development path
of T3G is very clear, plus their cooperation with leading
manufacturers like you, they can lead the development of
chips industry. By contrast, Commit wasn¡¯t clear about it,
which finally leads them to a tragic ending.
Wang Tong: When Samsung began operating in China, it was
made clear that we¡¯d want to make another Samsung ¨C a new
Samsung of China. Samsung paid significant attention to
the industrial policy and technical development trend in
China, it wasn¡¯t just my persuasion. Generally speaking,
Samsung wishes to break a new ground in China and expand
its market. So it is very important to follow the guidance,
promotion of Chinese government in terms of technology.
Wang Jing: That is crucial.
Wang Tong: At my position, I could understand the situation
better. In other words, this is the only way we could do
it. As one of the seven overseas research centers of Samsung,
we have to interact and integrate with the local trend of
technology and market demand. Now, we really benefit from
this decision. TD-SCDMA has began trial commercial use,
no longer a ¡°would-be¡±.
Wang Jing: You kept your promise to the headquarters (laughing).
Wang Tong: We have commercial outcome, and it seems the
gain is on the expansion. Also, the prospect of TD-SCDMA
and its future market share will be promising.
¡°Veto¡± Keeps the Samsung
Images, Advantage Kept in 3G Age
Wang Jing: Let¡¯s talk about recent TD-SCDMA bids. The first
was in the beginning of this year. In the total bid of 60
thousand machines, Samsung got 4500, taking up 7.5%. The
2nd phase of bid was 200 thousand machines and 15000 data
cards. Two models of Samsung phones won the bid, totally
20 thousand machines; the market share was 10%. How many
models won in the first bid?
Wang Tong: One, SGH-L288.
Wang Jing: And in the second bid, it was two.
Wang Tong: Yes, SGH-L288 and SGH-i688.
Wang Jing: Can you give us a comparative introduction on
your market share? And, please introduce to us how the functionality
of terminal has evolved in the 1st and 2nd bid?
Wang Tong: Yes, as to the two bids, we have special responsible
departments in China. I think you know the number, in the
1st bid, we provided approximately 5000 machines, and in
the 2nd bid, it was 20 thousand. During this period, we,
together with China Mobile, donated 15 thousand mobiles
phones to the BOCOG.
Wang Jing: And those 15000 are not included in the bid?
Wang Tong: Our donation of 15 thousand machines is for the
service of the Olympic family and is not included in the
bid.
About the first bid, my impression was, we really didn¡¯t
think too much about it. It wasn¡¯t about the market share
in the very beginning. Because we know for TD-SCDMA technology
at the current stage, no matter from the acceptance degree
of system, affordability of terminals, to the collaboration
of system and terminal, and to the network coverage, there
is a long way to go before it gets widely accepted. And
there is still distance with mature applications such as
WCDMA. There must be a process of improvement and growth.
Wang Jing: That means you paid attention on the overall
service quality, instead of quantity of users in the 1st
bid?
Wang Tong: Yes. Because we have so many GSM user base and
such a perfect and stable coverage, and CDMA is also mature
enough to support a large number of users, and TD-SCDMA,
in any sense, still remains a trial commercial use technology
and we really want to offer the commercial service to more
users or consumers.
Terminals are used in the network and services are realized
through a terminal. So the industry chain can only be complete
if the network and service provider work together closely.
Terminal device and do the thing on its own. So we are trying
to make it better and more stable to satisfy the operators
and consumers.
Wang Jing: This is what you thought during the 1st bid.
Wang Tong: Yes. But actually, we also kept development and
testing after the 1st bid. We can clearly feel the improvement
of network, system, technology and terminal devices. In
several short months, we can fee the network condition more
stable and much better. That¡¯s why we expanded supply in
the 2nd bid.
Wang Jing: Does this give you any pressure on delivery?
Wang Tong: There is no problem about the quantity, yet the
problem is about time.
Wang Jing: There needs to be a lead before delivery, and
it is always a problem for terminal providers.
Wang Tong: It is very important to have a projection on
market demand for all the terminal providers, especially
big companies. But as a matter of fact, our planning is
not flexible, because it is made up according to operator
demand instead of market research. So each time, it is inflexible
and unplanned.
Wang Jing: The operator didn¡¯t gave enough the time lead
before each bid.
Wang Tong: I believe this is true for all companies. For
the mature GSM terminals, the normal cycle from expressing
the demand to delivery of product, to release of a new model
takes 3 to 4 months.
Wang Jing: How about TD-SCDMA?
Wang Tong: Now actually, the cycle for TD-SCDMA is also
like this. Around 3 to 4 months. And now, such a time lead
is simply unavailable. Can we shorten it? Can we make it
quicker? Absolutely we can. But that will fail our internal
testing. Our internal testing is very comprehensive. If
a product fails to pass, it means a veto. How do we pass
the internal testing? Overworking is not the answer.
Wang Jing: That is why Samsung became Samsung. Quality is
the number one principle. No matter your thought in the
1st bid or in the whole testing period, this has always
been ensured. Indeed, after the trial commercial use of
TD-SCDMA began on April 1, we've noticed that the consumer
feedback indicated Samsung mobile phones are better than
other brands. This might also be what you expected from
the market.
Wang Tong: We think the comprehensive stability is the most
important in terms of function. Second, video telephony
should be done well as it is a good example of 3G. Because
these purchases used in business during the Olympic Games
basically serve the Olympic Games or, the volunteers, videos
are very important. Also, we think the quality of videos
is particularly important because TD-SCDMA is the international
standard for 3G.
In addition, we were hesitant about which direction we should
apply, dual-network dual-standby or automatic switching?
Now Samsung produces 2G/3G automatic switching, which is
the automatic switching with one number between two networks.
Although we think we make dual-mode dual-standby cell phones
of high quality, there are no signals for telephone numbers
with TD-SCDMA mode in many places in China. The signal of
3G did not cover the whole country when firstly introduced.
Besides, there are currently ten cities for TD-SCDMA signals
and even only the land inside 5th Ring Road in Beijing is
fully covered by the signals.
Wang Jing: So you think this is one basic feature of 3G
network at its early time.
Wang Tong: That¡¯s why we didn¡¯t do dual-mode dual-standby
at the beginning.
Wang Jing: Will you do it later? This is a model of TD-SCDMA
cell phone from ZTE available on the market that supports
dual-mode dual-standby.
Wang Tong: This depends on the demand in market, we will
definitely do it if required.
Wang Jing: ¡°Portable GSM number¡± is being called for in
the Forum as well as by the MIIT (Ministry of Industry and
Information Technology). It can¡¯t attract the customers
if they need to change another TD-SCDMA number for the TD-SCDMA
cell phone. If GSM number can be included in TD-SCDMA network,
it is not that urgent for dual-mode dual-standby. But automatic
switching is essential for its basic function.
Wang Tong: In fact we have successfully developed dual-mode
dual-standby. With a small volume, it is ready to be used
for business at any time after our further judgment in the
market.
Wang Jing: It is just about the time. How about HSDPA?
Wang Tong: We have developed HSDPA card.
Wang Jing: Then is Samsung one of the 15,000 cards in the
first public bidding?
Wang Tong: We have developed HSDPA cards with downstream
speeds of 2.8M. Currently we have the highest level of downstream
speeds. And this HSDPA card didn¡¯t participate in the bidding
of China Mobile.
Wang Jing: Personally, card application is an important
section in the early use of TD-SCDMA in business.
Wang Tong: Considering network capacity, coverage and use
from customers, we think dual-mode EDGE/TD-HSDPA card will
play an important role in future.
Wang Jing: Due to the fact that the card is easy to be made,
functionally reliable and with simple mode in terms of the
whole industry and its application, it will definitely outstand
later in the market.
Wang Tong: Besides, our push-to-talk is the biggest feature
in terms of function, which is developed independently by
our company only. Samsung is the only company providing
commercial products in terms of TD-SCDMA terminal. All 15,000
sets we provided the Olympic Games have PTT function, which
was required by the BOCOG.
Wang Jing: Are the 15,000 sets mainly used for
volunteers?
Wang Tong: It is for the whole Olympic family, not
volunteers.
Wang Jing: So who will be the users?
Wang Tong: The officials of the IOC, or the guests
they invited, or people involved in BOCOG, like judges,
referees and athletes, etc.
Wang Jing: To make it become a means of communication
during the Olympic Games.
Wang Tong: We can even use this function in some
cars to make the group bigger. Some are responsible for
transportation, some for security and some for the opening
and closing ceremonies, bringing great convenience to the
Olympic Games. This is a particular requirement they asked
from us, so all these 15,000 have this function.
Wang Jing: PTT is a characteristic of Samsung. Samsung
is a stockholder of T3G, it is the cell phone company that
pushes T3G¡¯s development. And Motorola also invested in
T3G. Are the chips used in your TD-SCDMA cell phones from
T3G?
Wang Tong: Yes, they are.
Wang Jing: Is there going to be any changes in future?
Wang Tong: Generally it depends on the market choice.
We need both cooperative partners to cover the market and
the room to make choices.
Wang Jing: There are many analogies for T3G. Such
as Datang, it had stock share in Commit, T3G and ADI at
early time. Although it is normal phenomenon for TD-SCDMA
at that time, but conflict of profit will occur among its
branches when developing in larger scale later.
Wang Tong: Right, so changes will be made at the
right time. Although they are close business partners, the
profits of each party don¡¯t go together. So changes will
surely be made.
Wang Jing: Will there be certain changes in future?
Wang Tong: During the development of TD-SCDMA, it
is possible for all the companies to be successful in the
market. Some chip companies are more tightly connected with
cell phones and televisions, some have advantages in MBMS,
some target the lower market by cheaper price or, some perform
well in TD-HSDPA. It is quite possible to form a situation
in which everyone competes by their own advantages and surely
the market choice is the most important.
Wang Jing: Samsung has also made achievements in
fields of 2G and WCDMA. Who are your major partners on those
fields?
Wang Tong: We have very extensive cooperation with
many partners. We are in partnership with all OS, chip vendors,
for example, Phillips, Qualcomm are all our partners.
Wang Jing: You really have wide cooperation.
Wang Tong: Yes, our cooperation is wide and inclusive.
Second, our cooperation is generally deep.
Wang Jing: So, the TD-SCDMA product of Samsung can
adopt the similar model as GSM and WCDMA and take the best.
Wang Tong: Right, we will have close cooperation
for TD-SCDMA too, and we would also have partners will different
advantages and their solutions.
Development of TD-SCDMA Depends
on the Development of Data Service
Wang Jing: What do you imagine the application situation
of TD-SCDMA will be as a 3G technology? In such a market
as China, what application can attract consumers? Because
I feel that the application of 3G is not yet very successful,
especially in the European market. And not 3G is not like
2G. In 2G era, voice and text message can support a huge
system. In China SMS service are numerous on 2G platform.
3G is a niche market where there are specified users. For
example, the target users of video telephony won¡¯t be us,
those who are in their 40¡¯s and 50¡¯s. I don¡¯t really want
to look at the other when talking on the phone, and they
might not want to see me as well. But young people would
like it. And there are also worries that young people could
not support such a market of big scale. However, given the
multi-million level huge user base in China, a small percentage
might be able to support an industry as well. This gives
particularity to the 3G market in China. Maybe a benign
cycle really could be established on the 3G market in China.
In China you also do the mobile TV business, won¡¯t it be
a good application in the age of 3G? How big is the potential
of video telephony? Are there other applications that make
3G appealing?
Wang Tong: In my opinion, the reason why the development
of 3G is so slow has something to do with that there has
not been a particular service package identifying this generation
of technology. The key difference between 3G and 2G is that
2G stresses on voice service whereas 3G is on data service.
As to the establishment of a particular service package,
there has to be a supporting infrastructure - abundant bandwidth,
and a number of data service applications. Users should
as well gradually accept and get familiar with such applications.
3G and the following 3.5G could only show its real effect
when the users begin to accept and get accustomed with various
data applications.
In the trial commercial uses of TD-SCDMA, there are many
opinions and quite a few comments are negative. But the
consensus is that, with 384k data car, Internet connection
is really much quicker. This is the advantage of 3G. I think
this has laid solid ground for the development of various
data services. I believe various data applications that
are suitable to Chinese users would emerge on the TD-SCDMA
network.
TD-SCDMA has a good future
Wang Jing: And the last question is about Samsung.
How do you expect the future of TD-SCDMA? Especially in
terms of TD-LTE, what is Samsung¡¯s plan, if the TD-SCDMA
evolution would move on?
Wang Tong: The future of TD-SCDMA is definitely very
broad. Now we could notice the significant improvement in
10 cities and these short months. The technology is showcased
on the Olympic Games, and many people are already using
it. With the previous trial commercial use, the orders and
user experience both soared. With the expansion of user
base, there are much less negative comments than in the
early April. With the promotion of Chinese market and active
effort of operators, I believe the positive prospective
is beyond any doubt. Now, no matter in terms of technology
or establishment of industry and services, there wasn¡¯t
any problem. We never doubted the future of TD-SCDMA, and
are much more confident now.
Wang Jing: China Mobile pays much attention on terminal
and is eager to see more terminals joining. And how about
TD-LTE?
Wang Tong: We will follow China Mobile. As to terminal
devices, we will continue playing crucial role on TD-SCDMA.
We have engaged in the research into LTE in the headquarters
in South Korea and research center here in China.
Wang Jing: But the schedule must be tight.
Wang Tong: Schedule is tight, yet the establishment
of a standard should be done step by step. It was a long
process from proposition of TD-SCDMA as a standard to discussion,
to being finally accepted by ITU, to the following development,
testing and road testing and operator testing. Additionally,
for LTE, I don¡¯t think anyone is sure when the standard
could be stabilized, or would the whole industry chain be
able to follow up. It can only be pushed step by step.
Wang Jing: It need much time.
Wang Tong: From 3G to LTE, a process of stabilization
and maturity is needed. That is to say, you can only make
the next move after a service package is mature in a large
scale and on a large user base. Meanwhile, there are still
much possibility after the adoption of HSDPA and HSUPA.
We can't forget the history, we can¡¯t move from narrow bandwidth
to broadband over night. Now our applications are lack of
good platform and channel, and thus not able to be demonstrated.
But when the bandwidth reaches 2.8M, is it enough? We need
to walk step by step. As a matter of fact, TD-SCDMA is not
yet shown to the public. The amount is so little that it
is incomparable with multi-million users and that many devices.
This number even can¡¯t reach the number of PHS terminal
devices.
Wang Jing: This phenomenon is only temporary. I think
the overall performance of TD-SCDMA is much better than
the previous phase, because the market prospect is clear
and bright. This used to be a big problem limiting the development
of the whole industry chain. A while ago, such problem was
so huge that a company as Commit died and no one was able
to help. And the situation is much better now. But problems
remain. We don¡¯t have grand strategy and feasible plans.
Everyone knows to support TD-SCDMA, and no one would deny
TD-SCDMA. But what is the overall strategy? What is the
plan in 1 or 2 years, or 3 or 5 years? As to the network,
what would the future scale be? Like the national 5-Year
Plans, TD-SCDMA also needs a target. Take the Olympic Games
as an example. There are many detail plans after you decide
to do it. And with those plans you can prepare for it in
an orderly and organized way in the 7 years.
Wang Tong: We call that the target network, which
means how the basic would network structure be like at a
certain historic phase.
Wang Jing: Such plans should be there from the beginning.
And there should be a plan and corresponding measures to
support such plan. I believe this could be in place in the
near future. Now, the relevant organizations are making
industrial policy and is about to give out a plan. This
is beneficial to international terminal companies as you.
Because the plan is clearly there, and you can arrange you
product line and make detailed plans. So, we would have
an industrial policy roundtable in Dalian in late August
to provide policy-making suggestions.
Wang Tong: Yes, the future is bright. The only question
is how quick we go.
Wang Jing: Well, that is all for today. The interview
with Mr. Wang is very helpful and informative to us, as
well as to the readers. We really appreciate the long-time
support from Samsung Telecommunications Research Center
and Mr. Wang Tong. And we are looking forward to further
cooperation at the TD-SCDMA Forum.
Wang Tong: Thanks to the Forum and Mr. Wang Jing.
I appreciate the effort TD-SCDMA Forum has made to provide
a platform of communication. We are looking forward to future
close ties and chances for communication with the Forum.
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